Dude, the whole point of a feeder tank is to not feed your fish the diseased feeders that die during quarantine...
NEMATODES
i ahve the planari in my tank, but as i was gettin a dead guppy out of my feeder tank, that freslky died i held it up and watched works swim into the gills, if this it a parasite, and i feed them to my ps, will my ps get them too>
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there are a few parasites that will be transfered through injestion. Free living planaria or flatworms (platyhelminthys) that you can see in the aquarium, are in the Turbellaria group and are scavengers mostly. They will feed on the dead fish and most likely will enter the gill cavety. Flatworms usualy "boom" in an aquarium because of large amounts of organic matter (overfeeding). They are introduced usually through live foods. More regulated tank matinence usally dwindles their numbers down. But really, dont feed fish that probably died of parasites to your p's. Like eltwitcho said, why even quarantine your feeders? As with most worm lifecycles though you ususally need a first and second intermediate host like mussles, crustaceans and birds to complete the cycle.
Second thought. one nematode Camallanus cant remember if spelled right dosent need the intermediate host and can plauge livebearing fish for several generations.
Anyway, worm lifecyles are usually so complex that you wont run into any problems in an aquarium. Its quite normal to have imported fish carrying a variety of nematodes, cestodes, and flukes. They ususlly die if the fish are well cared for.
Second thought. one nematode Camallanus cant remember if spelled right dosent need the intermediate host and can plauge livebearing fish for several generations.
Anyway, worm lifecyles are usually so complex that you wont run into any problems in an aquarium. Its quite normal to have imported fish carrying a variety of nematodes, cestodes, and flukes. They ususlly die if the fish are well cared for.
Agreed, good post Channafreak. There are parasitic nematodes, by the way (although the ones on the glass, the most common ones we see, are not).
There can absolutely be transmission from fish to fish, a snail host isn't always needed. Just look at snakes that eat snakes (indigo snake for example) and fish that eat fish (my aces for example), they tend to have a good amount of parasites.
There can absolutely be transmission from fish to fish, a snail host isn't always needed. Just look at snakes that eat snakes (indigo snake for example) and fish that eat fish (my aces for example), they tend to have a good amount of parasites.
Yes many many parasitic nematodes. But nematodes are roundworms. Im just assuming that the worms he is refering to are platyhelminths, which contain 4 groups. Turbellaria, which the planarians belong to, Monogenea, which are all one host flukes, Digenea, again all parasitic one or two host flukes, and the cestodes, which are tapeworms and quite parasitic.
That birngs up the question if they are present in the tank. If you can see them on the glass, on the substrait, and they are flat, then I would assume Turbellaria group planarians and probably scavengers. If they are in fact nematodes, a lot of times after a host dies they will try and exit the body cavity, usually not the gills however because they locate themselves in the digestive system, body cavity, and swim bladder. Nematodes are the most likely to transfer hosts without any intermediate hosts because they are excreted and can likely be injested again by other fish.
So are worms present in your feeder tank?
That birngs up the question if they are present in the tank. If you can see them on the glass, on the substrait, and they are flat, then I would assume Turbellaria group planarians and probably scavengers. If they are in fact nematodes, a lot of times after a host dies they will try and exit the body cavity, usually not the gills however because they locate themselves in the digestive system, body cavity, and swim bladder. Nematodes are the most likely to transfer hosts without any intermediate hosts because they are excreted and can likely be injested again by other fish.
So are worms present in your feeder tank?
More good info! I actually have seen nematodes boring out of the sides of f/w barracudas before! A vet from the aquarium was so confused that he thought they were anchorworms! I didn't know any better until a post mortem dissection!
Wow... thats a serious case. I wish I had some photos of the "jaws" of some of these nematodes. Modified drill bits at best. The kind of dammage they can do is unbeleivable. There is another worm in the Acanthocephala group. They have "spiney heads" that are retractable on a proboscis. They can bore into vital organs quite easily as well. The complexity of the family is inspiring when you consider the lifecycles and resiliance.
Was your acestro alive when the nematodes were exposed?
Was your acestro alive when the nematodes were exposed?
It was alive. The treatment killed the fish. I've had other aces have this happen and survive, they're very weird that way. There are papers just one acestro parasites, they've found a way to live with them.
I had a pic through a microscope of a nematode up close, it was wicked! It was one that infected watersnakes.
I had a pic through a microscope of a nematode up close, it was wicked! It was one that infected watersnakes.
channafreak said:Wow... thats a serious case. I wish I had some photos of the "jaws" of some of these nematodes. Modified drill bits at best. The kind of dammage they can do is unbeleivable. There is another worm in the Acanthocephala group. They have "spiney heads" that are retractable on a proboscis. They can bore into vital organs quite easily as well. The complexity of the family is inspiring when you consider the lifecycles and resiliance.
Was your acestro alive when the nematodes were exposed?
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After reviewing this one more time I can see my flaw in explanation. In the wild fish are exposed to parasitic worms regularly because in nature the parasites have means for perpetuation through various hosts. In an aquarium however the intermediate hosts are not present and usually dissapear without the proper lifecycle to be fully met. (usually but not always, the parasite has to be reinjested by other fish from waste where nematodes are excreted) You were definatly correct in pointing this out ace. I was thinking it and didnt type it. A vast majoraty of aquatic creatures out there live with these types of parasites as part of a natural ecosystem. Doing but minimal if any real dammage to the fish at all. Some do considerable dammage and kill the host eventually like the cestodes, but ill be dammed if you could catch a cod out there and not find several nematodes living within the fish. That acestro paper sounds like an interesting read if you got it.acestro said:It was alive. The treatment killed the fish. I've had other aces have this happen and survive, they're very weird that way. There are papers just one acestro parasites, they've found a way to live with them.
I had a pic through a microscope of a nematode up close, it was wicked! It was one that infected watersnakes.
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I'll try to dig up some parasite papers...
Not aces but here's two (one was shown to me by Frank, both a piranha related). No easy access to the ace parasite pics, and my laptop (currently frozen) has the incredible pics of the parasites coming out of the sides of the body.
http://www.mnhn.fr/publication/zoosyst/z01n1a1.pdf
http://www.paru.cas.cz/folia/pdf/1-03/Azev.pdf
Not aces but here's two (one was shown to me by Frank, both a piranha related). No easy access to the ace parasite pics, and my laptop (currently frozen) has the incredible pics of the parasites coming out of the sides of the body.
http://www.mnhn.fr/publication/zoosyst/z01n1a1.pdf
http://www.paru.cas.cz/folia/pdf/1-03/Azev.pdf
Unfreeze that bitch up!!acestro said:I'll try to dig up some parasite papers...
Not aces but here's two (one was shown to me by Frank, both a piranha related). No easy access to the ace parasite pics, and my laptop (currently frozen) has the incredible pics of the parasites coming out of the sides of the body.
http://www.mnhn.fr/publication/zoosyst/z01n1a1.pdf
http://www.paru.cas.cz/folia/pdf/1-03/Azev.pdf
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lol. We should start a name that nematode thread.....
I'm about to throw the bitch out the window! I'll probably mail it to a friend of mine to see what he can save... I don't know if I could name any nematodes!!!
great informative read channa and ancestro. i used to have worms that floated around the tank with the current (not free swimming) and were very thin (but not flat) and white. What kind of worms are those, and are they parasitic?
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